Heya dudes and dudettes!
It is I again with a commentary on the largely indie hip-hop scene in Indonesia, with cutting-edge analyses on why y’all are finding it so, so hard to break through commercially.
This is a HansRock Closer Look (TM). *Ting*
Anyways, today’s article looks into the use of English raps by Indonesian rappers. Now there’s no problem whatsoever with using English, and I’ve used it in my raps with no objection from industry insiders. It works for me because I’m a native speaker and it is admittedly my first language so my sounds are comparable with any billboard rap, strictly speaking.
So what’s the problem?
Two articles ago I mentioned about rappers (or singers, for that matter) who should not expect to be taken seriously if their TOEFL is less than 500 and still try to write English works.
That’s one thing, but on the other hand what we have are okay English speakers with weird hard-to-lose accents. Observe this clip from a recent gig:
Ho. Ly. Crap.
Holy shit dudes, what were you thinking??! You guys looked great and gangsta up there but then you had to ruin the show by rapping in pig latin. Even the Indonesian rap was all over the place. Man, I’d hate to be there. It embarasses ME to see that kind of attempt being pulled off.
Okay enough with the bashing. But you must know by now what I’m getting at. It’s your frickkkin accents duuudes! Unless you were doing it deliberately a la Dr. Bombay, you’re just making a fool of yourself.
If your English speech or rap doesn’t sound like it’s coming from a native speaker, rap in your native tongue! Absolutely nothing wrong with that!
Here’s an Indonesian rapper who DOES get it:
See the difference? His English is natural. Swerte’s got some great work by the way, pity he’s all the way in the Emirates. More room for me then.
I am SO resisting the temptation to list down names of culprits, lest I cross the thin line between critic and hater. I’m a critic fellas, and I make commentary from a commercial-oriented point of view. So I’m not going to stand up and say “Long Live IndoHipHop!” But I will say “IndoHipHop, Go Back To School, study your English and watch more
Hollywood!”
Keep it real, not fakin’ support, and always be open-minded. In the music world, it’s every man for himself, so be careful what you try to make public lest you embarrass yourselves like those Earth day rappers up there.
Much respect, see you next post!
February 13th, 2010 on 9:35 am
@DOYZTRON
hollysh*t… doyz where are you man??!! been lost contact with you thru years…. hit me up on facebook..search for “sants adi”… ypu find me there…lot things to catch doyz…lots of things…..
-jovee-
February 15th, 2010 on 5:34 am
Interesting topic. Let’s air this out some more.. Unfortunately I’m on BB so my comments will have to be prolonged til I get online fams.
February 15th, 2010 on 7:44 am
Gw suka tulisan yang mengundang diskusi ini. Gw setuju dengan “IndoHipHop, Go Back To School, study your English and watch more Hollywood!”
Masalah aksen atau logat gw rasa nggak masalah. Itu justru akan menjadi keunikan sendiri buat rapper Indonesia di mata internasional. Tetapi untuk masalah tata bahasa Inggris yang kacau balau, orang Indonesia memang harus banyak belajar karena kita tahu, makna bisa berubah jika tata bahasanya salah. Jadi jangan malas belajar
Namun..
Jangan hanya karena bahasa Inggris kita nggak sempurna, kita jadi takut berkarya. Bikin musik yang bagus, bikin lirik yang bagus! Jika masih takut tata bahasa Inggrisnya masih amburadul kayak gw, minta tolong pada kawan yang lebih mumpuni. Orang bisnis sih bilangnya: Outsourcing
Salam. Maju terus hiphop Indonesia!
February 15th, 2010 on 8:10 am
Hello everyone…
I’ve read your recent postings, quite interesting, thanks for the input guys, both pro and cons they both good feedbacks so I appreciated it, as y’all probably discussed it before it seems like so much work needs to be done on my behalf, so any constructive feedbacks pretty much welcome anytime, holla back…
regards,
ojink
February 15th, 2010 on 9:40 am
I ain’t no MC but I do know how badly Indonesians treated their music, especially among the young generation. The soul is not there, there’s no passion involved. On some cases, being part of a group or a band is cool enough to get your name around, it becomes a fame game. As us musicians/artists(seniman, not artis!) try harder to spread the joy that was once good music, the more we’re lost in certain agendas that was unnaturally forced on common business. I don’t rap, although I write music, but I know good lyrics when I hear it, I grew up among the greats of the New York underground writers/lyricist. Writing takes time, it takes practice and effort which might sound oblivious to most kids these days. The instant stardom can’t sound too bad, so this is why bad music is all around us. And like someone said on the above comments, what the fuck would you write about when there’s no experience involved? Unless you have someone else write it for you, but then that wouldn’t make you an MC would it? Spitting something that’s not yours is plain pathetic and embarrassing. And for the girl that has gotten upset from all the bashing towards the video, just be glad you weren’t rapping in the ghetto where things like that are unforgivable. Humbly accept the criticism. Or at least that’s what I think.
February 15th, 2010 on 10:16 am
That’s sounds just about right and thank you for the feedback by the way, point taken. quite constructive, I appreciated it.
one.
ojink
February 15th, 2010 on 5:42 pm
??I must say all this I think I’m better than anyone else comment and bashing on other peeps re the very thing making Indo Hip Hop scene still in the current situation.
Some crack head deported,english teachers and flight attendants tryin to criticize other peeps how to rap? Come on if someone wanna rap, let em. No need for further comment on their personal live or whatsoever. At least they re doin somethin while most of u not doin shit bout the whole indo hiphop scene. I don’t like Saykoji’s works but I respect him a lot for what he’s doin for hiphop in Indo. So instead of bitchin do somethin about it bitches!
February 15th, 2010 on 6:09 pm
And for some washed out has been rappers that suckin ass w the 234 by sayin oh they’re the real gangsta. I only have to say this “where uve been man?”. Like some of this peep referred to u. So where uve been man? Shush. I know for sure jinx never handed u car keys? U got beef yet always all nice in front of him? Can’t even tell him shiz? And swerte is a skanky ass u never gonna say that to his face, how’s the drug problem man? Since u all straight bashing we’ll be straight bashing too. No respects for peeps like you.
Ps. How’s flight attending job going on so far, rick boy? Sweet jeebus people only know hiphop if they travel? I guess talentless stupid people can be flight attendant and know ALL about hiphop. Hah. GANGSTAH.
February 15th, 2010 on 6:24 pm
this Bangladeshi blog is unbelieveable. It unites people from different area and perspective. Is this funded by the Grameen Bank? Muhammad Yunus must be proud.
For the hiphop itself, i dont know why this-is-how-you-should-rap attitude is hard to kill.
Akon and Sean Kingston are annoying like fuck, but Jay-Z doesnt tell em to shut up.
Seriously, you didnt consider Ojink (to be honest, i havent heard his tracks) and other culprits you were referring as bad as Taylor Swift, and annointed yourself as Kanye West, did you?
ps: im sure this blog is funded by Grameen Bank. Muhammad Yunus FTW!
February 15th, 2010 on 7:37 pm
Ayt yall, this topic has had some harsh words thrown around that were quite unecessary. Since the highlighted video includes me & friends of mine I’m obliged to respond. I already know most of yall well. The author of this post however, I do not. Plz allow me to introduce myself. My name’s Mistah and I rep Diplomats Int http://www.myspace.com/dipnetwerk. Ayt lemme get to the point.
I respect the fact that everyone has the right to an opinion. I also respect your right to dislike or like an opinion. The topic of the use of Bi-lingual raps is healthy and something which I think could be debated into infinite. Yall kan go in on eachother as much as u want but LEAVE THE PERSONAL SHYT ALONE!.let it be about the MUSIC.
Peace
Mistah
February 16th, 2010 on 12:59 am
Hey there y’all…
Looks like I see things got a bit hostile here so let me remedy the situation,
First of all, I really appreciate the comments and critics because both of ‘em are considerably constructive. If I am easily satisfied with my current work, there would be no progress in the future if there’s no critics ‘right?, still so much work needs to be done, and thank you so much for the buzz and feedbacks, I still really need to improve myself.
Second of all, let’s not get carried away with all that personal attacks, it doesn’t make any of us looked good anyhow, no positive outcome could be resulted by this, we should’ve known better that this. I’m personally respected all peeps point of views about hip hop from their own perspectives and their own personal knowledge about the music and the culture itself. from my humble perspective everyone has the right to expressed their creativity and that is why I just keep doing what I do, keeping myself busy with my own creation, doing my own thing, don’t want to hurt nobody so I don’t feel the need to start shit with someone that I am barely knew.
In the end of the day is about making music, we all create it and share it with the world at the best of our own abilities and yes, we all know that none of us is perfect but ever stop doing what you do now in music otherwise there would be no progress.
I just wanna say I respected all y’all and I’ll be supporting all y’all making hip hop in indonesia better and greater than ever before.
Respect,
Ojink
February 16th, 2010 on 7:16 am
To Mistah and Ojink:
You’re handling this pretty well, bro’s. Regardless of anything, criticism hurts, but you took it well. I hope this discussion doesn’t degenerate into dissing each other, because in that case I’m going to have to moderate shit, and I won’t like it, lol.
Keep it coming, there’s something good for all of us here.
To Pangeran:
LOL on the Muhammad Yunus remark! I wouldn’t mind Grameen funding any of my activities at all hehe. It’s not a Bangladeshi blog, though, we got one author based in B’desh. Myself, I’m in Indonesia.
My main point is that people should make good music, it’s not really a matter of how you should rap or whatever. When I listen to a song, I’d like to enjoy it. That’s all. I’m not a technique guy (except for the production side, hence my articles on basic mixing).
February 16th, 2010 on 7:37 am
It’s all good man, no biggie…
We’re here to make music not making enemies, spread the album not the hate. he he he
Thanks again, y’all this shall motivates me to do it even greater next time.
Peace.
-Ojink-
February 16th, 2010 on 10:33 am
wow.. seems like someone’s getting personal on shit.. watch how u throw ur punches man.. so far, all the critisicm has been related to the music.. maybe a few stories were told to back up the opinions on the music but there wasnt any real straight out disses for no reason.. jinx is my boy, and i’ll tell u now and i always say to people this no matter what, if it wasn’t for ojink, i wouldn’t have got into this rap game. he took me in and we rocked shows in jakarta together and even won some nationals with straight scores over some legends. i know he’s just havin fun and doing his thing and that he doesnt mean any harm. But i still wont go around to people out here and where ever i go and show them his video and say, “this is indo hiphop..” no.. this is ojink.. if u see your daughter talking to him… and she’s under 21… u better be worried..
I know he’s not really making music in hopes of changing the scene or anything. he’s just having fun. (bener nga jinx?) unfortunatly he’s been used as an example here to show and demonstrate how bad the english raps are in Indo, for up and comin mcs who want to better the scene and name of indo hiphop. But i think thats where the goals are different. I wanna know how everyone here in this topic will go now and change what they’re doing to help the scene and hiphop in indo. And i guess in a way, this is a chance for jinx to challenge himself and everyone and see if he can put something out that will make everyone in here shut up about his skill and show that if he really wanted to, he can create something thats decent and “real”.
February 16th, 2010 on 12:33 pm
It’s aight man, It’s okay, let’ just all forget about all this ‘mishaps’ and let us just create music the best that we that know how, It’s all works out for the best anyways, especially to all of us.
All that I care right now that we keep on preserving hip-hop music in Indonesia the best we know how, I am doing my part and just like you guys out there doing yours, we keep shit happening with our own ways and our own abilities.
let’s just squashed this beefs and start writting and producing good music, some of y’all old cats know that I’ve been in the game since ‘1995, it’s not an overnight thing to me and I’ve seen lots of things even way more fucked up than this that is why I take it easy and been through a lot to know what’s really important than just beefin’ all the time, and that is creating good music the best that I can…after all this time I am still proudly say that, I am still in the learning process, still long way to go from perfections, still learning. And that is why, I really appreciates all the inputs, critics and feedbacks that would helped me constructively perfecting my work…
And yes, swerte wasn’t playing about me banging all the teenage girls man, HA HA HA…so if you happened to know any hot teenage girls out there, better keep her outta sight man, for real…HAHAHAH ( just kidding )
Last But Not Least,
I respect y’all equally and because of all y’all that hip-hop still exists and prevails in Indonesia for the next future generations to come, that’s what really matters to me. And I’ll be supporting all of you and welcoming you to contribute your music anywhere you are, in Indonesia or Abroad, doesn’t really matters to me. Keep creativity flowing and so perhaps one day, the rest of the world would share and listens to it ! let ‘em know This is talented cats of Indo Hip Hop ! straight up made by the sons of Indonesia!
Peace,
- Ojink -
February 17th, 2010 on 11:32 am
Pangeran : Jay-z did tell them to shut up. He wrote Death of Autotune.
February 17th, 2010 on 11:50 am
Why do people throw punches in the dark. If you need to say some harsh shit .. say it out in the open, not behind an alias. What a bitchass
I know I dish out alota shit .. Im not afraid to take it aswell, and so far this has been a pretty intelligent discussion. I’ll sit down with anyone here and have a beer. But I’ll also go toe to toe if you talkin bullshit
February 17th, 2010 on 3:40 pm
Hey man,
Look don’t let these comments from peeps bothered you man, because for me honestly i don’t take it personally, and I’m we’re both grown man should know better than just be disoriented by plain harsh words that people were saying, because in the end of the day, it’s just words man, we took the good ones and forget about the bad ones. what’s important is that you had voiced a good critics, giving good feedbacks and I Thank you for it. I honestly think its a good feedback ( no joke ) and pretty constructive to support my work and I get your point and don’t worry, I don’t get all that personal shit gets to me, just like I say it’s just words, I’ll dust it off like dirt on my shoulder like Jay-Z would say, because after all it’s a free speech right? it’s cool to expressed your opinion what so ever, at least that is what I think.
Other than that, we probably get off on the wrong foot here man, Obviously I don’t know you and you seems like you don’t know me that well, probably based on random stories that you heard about me, either it’s true or not.
But I would like to get to know you and be friends with you. Just like you said that we can go out and have a beer, have few laughs and then you can give me all the feedback all you want in person man and I guarantee you that you will find me as an easy going person and also an open minded one.
so for the other fellas out there, I would like to say please there’s no need for us to continue with the personal issues bashing, let it just be about music and healthy inputs, it’s not gonna solved anything and its only going make things worse, and none of us is perfect.
So Unql Riq, I know that you probably lived abroad now but if you feel like whenever you wanna have a beer and hangout while you’re in Jakarta. my door is always open and I would like to have intelligent discussions with you in person, and let me get a chance to get to know you better.
Aight dudes, I’mma head back to the studio and lemme know the latest, holla !
Peace.
Ojink
February 17th, 2010 on 5:07 pm
kids are right tho.
we complaining but we have yet to inject something better than them..
we should just stop complaining and start producing.
I just wanted to say to the person who took the liberty of letting everyone know about my secret life as a flight attendant, your mum calls me captain.
February 17th, 2010 on 5:17 pm
Ojink .. I met you 3 time already .. twice in bali once in Jakarta. 2 times I reintroduced myself to you and we spoke about lucky all 3 times. One time you told me yourself you had just banged a 16 year old girl in the bathroom.
Whatever the case dude I appreciate the open handed gesture and without a doubt I’m sure we’ll meet for the 4th time and talk about lucky ..
Riq
February 17th, 2010 on 6:27 pm
Riq, you secretly know a lot. Either that or Ojink was high/drunk then and didn’t realize what the hell came out of his mouth. This is why everyone should watch what they say, we know it’s nothing but words but people kill each other/themselves because of it. Be smart, yea? I don’t know most of you but I know all of you ain’t dumb. Better yet, battle it out! Quit trashing.
A girl gotta say what a girl need to say.
Peace.
February 17th, 2010 on 8:43 pm
aight riq, next time drinks on me ! we go have another constructive conversations about music man. help me be a better mc than I was before, inputs does matter
and J, I wasn’t drunk/high when I said that, first of all I don’t blaze and if you knew the deal back then even most people I knew, knows about that story
Enough crazy talk, Let’s just get back to work everyone!
Peace,
-Ojink-
peace,
ojink
February 18th, 2010 on 2:41 pm
It seems that someone really like to throw a punch in the dark.Thats too bad.However,i’ll take your critics in a positive point of view.
You are i right i was being too damn hars with Ojink,by telling something stupid about his personal thing.That was so unprofessional.If this thread was meant for the perspective in music,there i was,straying way too far.
Therefore i stand up and send my apologies to anyone here whom i may offended.Especially to Ojink.I am really Sorry dude,i was carried away,when someone said about observation thing.I shouldnt said stupid things like that in the first place,since our concern was supposed to be one thing:music (Mistah was right.)
Eventually you guys are right tho,no use for complaining if we dont create something.
So to someone remain anonymous upthere,thanks for the critics.I’ll make sure to keep you alarmed,when my things are settled for this washed out has been rappers to make a come back.
February 18th, 2010 on 5:44 pm
Hey doyz,
It’s okay man, Let’s just forget about it man, I didn’t take personally anyways man because what’s really matter is tomorow not yesterday anyways right?
Actually, I was kinda flattered to be corrected by the ‘ Mighty Doyz Da Noize ‘ Himself, hahaha to be honest, you are one of my old school favourite man, I used to go watch ‘ BLACK KUMUH ‘ Performing on stage while one of you guys holding a ” KOTEKA ” in the hand while bringin ‘ Insane in the brain’ using the instrumentals by The Onyx, hahaha remember that man? ha ha ha back then when ratu plaza still has a concert hall and we’re all celebrating IWA.K’s birthday on-stage, ha ha ha!
Anyways man, let’s just forget about this ‘misunderstanding’ and start motivates each other to bring hip-hop back to life just like it was in ‘98, and I hope this shall motivates all of us to contribute more flavor on Indonesia Hip-Hop Scene
I am fully support, looking forward for your ‘come back’ man, I’m sure it’s going to be one helluva ‘ ressurection’ man, I wish you all the best man and I’m sure it’s going to be one of the historical moments in Indonesian Hip hop scene.
Keep up the good work guys !
Peace,
-Ojink-
February 18th, 2010 on 7:56 pm
Being subject to criticism is nothing new to me so its Good to see erbody air out their shyt. I’m glad to see we all have a common goal and perspective in working towards the state of Indo HipHop. I’ve always believed my true peeps were never ‘yes men’ and wouldn’t hesitate to criticise my work if they didn’t feel it or thought it was lacking something.
I actually totally forgot bout that performance but I think it was a perfect example ( like as stated by Riq ) on the importance in attention to detail in ones work. So for that, I’m not going to point any fingers at anyone but myself (may he who has no sin cast the first stone).
What I’m implying is that we as individuals are responsible for elevating Hiphop the best we kan which is by always pushing ourselves to be on top of our game. Now I’m no JayZ or Nas. You, me and yo grandma know this. But the level of QUALITY in which I’m trying to achieve as an individual is to set an international standard for the MUSIC. Meaning that if my friends in Sydney, Amsterdam or NY can’t HONESTLY enjoy what I’m making then, I feel like I’ve failed to some degree.
Music aside, rap is about communication. Pure and Simple. We are communicating with the listener. Whether the lyrics are about slangin rocks or what u had for breakfast. Ok, now Let me coincide this with the original topic. There’s a lot of rappers in Indo who are not native english speakers but use english in their raps with the utmost confidence. I have nothing but support for these cats. English is the key to many doors and I also see it as the key to reaching the ears of the rest of the hiphop world. The amount of contentious issues, stories and tales from the capital city are being restricted in reaching a listener overseas purely because of the language barrier. I have no problem with accents. It took the UK and Australia time for to find their individual identities and once they did their own heads embraced them with pride.
It may sound nerdy but Grammar is probably the most important component that’s lacking in many of the questionable raps. Sentence structure, the misuse of prepositions and pronunciation are all vital parts which could make a potentially dope verse unbearable to listen to if not corrected. make sure its all TIGHT before u stamp a verse done did. If english is your second language my advice is to triple check your writing and don’t be afraid to ask someone with a better knowledge of the language ( I’d do the exact same thing if I wrote in Bahasa ).
Anyways, I’m just throwin my 2 cents in the air like erbody else. Its up to you if u wanna catch it or not. I’m happy to see so many passionate people with good intentions and real talent here contributing to the Indo hiphop game. Real recognise real. So let’s make this happen.
Bless
Mistah
February 18th, 2010 on 9:45 pm
Btw Mota who is u?
February 19th, 2010 on 6:37 am
@mistah…
yep… i ask the same question for that girl… i havent heard girl with that a lot of knowledge… in bandung… even i know the low-pro.. but this one… its “cadmus cases” heheh…..
February 19th, 2010 on 11:43 am
NOT INTERESTED in people’s pedophile adventures, man (I’m talking to you, Ojink). Reserve that for the erotic story websites. What’s wrong with you, dude?
Anyway, teens are too easy, give yourself a challenge LOL
February 19th, 2010 on 5:47 pm
Wdup, Jinx.
I respect your positive feedback in embracing all inputs.
No doubt,i do remember every little moments you mentioned above.Those are the times of the spark,where we should really concern to bring it back.Off course with much more advanced abilities than we’ve done years before.
I appreciate your good wishes to me,and i also do wish you all the best for what you’ve been doing,and certainly looking forward for you elevating yourself to a better level.
-Doyz-
February 20th, 2010 on 10:29 am
let’s keep this about music? aight.
Doyz youre no legend, your flow is really bad, from one sentence to another you still rap the same way. flow the same shit. then the 2nd verse come along AND WOW YOU STILL FLOW THE SAME WAY.
then i listen to another song, WHAT IS THIS DUDE SMOKING MAN? Swerte’s old joints? HE STILL RAP ENTIRELY THE SAME? Then after i finish an album..BLAOW KILL ME NAWW STILL RAP LIKE THAT? bejeeesssus.
Another prob? u cant even speak your original lingo right, saying “shhh” instead of “S”. “SHHHTATISHHH SHAMPAIII ESHOOOK HARIIII”
Statis indeed, years still don’t improve you so better not throwing critics. still wont help how you’re having major attitude problem, man.
As for Rick no more words, fags will still gonna be faaaaaags mannn. HORAS.
February 20th, 2010 on 3:49 pm
hahahaha .. that was a pretty good line tho .. what was he smoking swerte’s old joints. If I respond in nursery rhyme does it still count as being music related ? for example …
Its been obvious from the start but you gave it away when you used lingo instead of language.
The mummy unravelled to reveal the rotten corpse underneath the bandage
I know I shouldn’t pick on girls, even when they’re acting toy.
But its mad confusing when in a dress you look like a 12 year old boy
Knick Knack paddy whack, I know you’re scared, where you hiding at?
Willy Wonka called, they’re short an oompa loompa and need their worker back
Its hard to take you seriously, looking like a cabbage patch kid.
We all agree you sound pretty whack, even the girls who who commented did.
So you got your feelings hurt. You’re dishing dirt mcgirt on me doyz, lucky Swert, Ernie, Bert and anyone else who dares call you Bezerk. Did you ever stop to consider that maybe you need to stop being defensive and bigheaded and start putting in work?
You mad but you couldn’t sound hard with your raps wrapped in plaster
A Natural Deesaster,
Refering to your ugly head
I wouldn’t consider fuckin you with Ojink’s dick, even if I hadta.
BIIYAAAATCHH!!
February 21st, 2010 on 9:26 am
im curious.. who does rickisafaganddoyzsuckcock put on a pedestal from indo?… cuz if he doesnt put anyone up, then i think we all gotta work and start raising the bar.. cus his attitude is exactly my point on how people look at the hiphop music in indo..
February 21st, 2010 on 3:30 pm
Whoops..Looks like someones getting sloppy by blew up the covers.
I never self claimed my self to be a “Legend”.Its your rap mentor and your surroundings who labelled me that way.